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Ask Alan Archive Page 3
Model 32 Crown Grade David B. Garten - 20:28 26/10/1998
Is there any reason to be concerned about buying a Model 32 if it appears to be in good condition? Also, what changes of substance were made when the Model 32 became the K-80 and what is required to make those changes in an old gun?
Model 32 Crown Alan - 08:19 27/10/1998
You can buy a Model 32 with confidence as many parts are interchangeable with the K-80, those parts tht aren't are still available from the factory. Barrels from a K-80 will fit as will the woodwork, although the K-80 guard has a tail and the model 32 does not. In this case you could either change the guard or patch the inletting in the stock for the tail. With regard to changes in the mechanism it depends on the serial number of the Model 32, if you can let me have that then I can be more exact. One clue is the lever on the right hand side of the action that holds open the top latch, if it is a large lever located forward of the top latch, identical to the K-80, it is a late model and has many more components in common with the K-80. If the lever is a tiny one situated right back, almost under the top latch the gun is earlier. Update possibility will depend on age. Let me have the number and I will see if I can give you some more information.
Alan Krieghoff Serial Numbers W J Sidebotham - 11:19 05/11/1998
Alan
Could you give some details of the design changes
relating to serial numbers as the Remington 3200
evolved via the K32 into the K80.
Best regards
John
Serial Numbers Alan - 08:04 06/11/1998
John,
Firstly the Remington 3200 has no connection to either the K-32 or K-80. The original Remington Model 32 was discontinued by Remington in the early 1950s. A group of shooters who thought that the design still had future potential approached Krieghoff to see if they were interested in producing the gun and so the Krieghoff Model 32 was born. Over the years the design has been constantly refined, one of the first changes was to the trigger mechanism. The Remington 3200 was a gun that Remington started to produce in, I think 1974, it was not a commercial success and was discontinued after a very short time. The 3200 however still has some fans. Although possible to give you a list of design changes by serial number it is really not practical to do so. this is because even today the K-80 is a constantly chnging gun. Every time the factory see the possibility of making a small change to the design, that will improve either performance or strength, they do it. Consequently there are literally 1,000s of tiny changes, most of which are not visible. Although the information is available in the factory records, no one has ever set it down on paper in the form of a list. The last major change to the K-80 was around serial No 20000, when the tumbler and sear design was changed. If there is anything specific that you would like to know I am sure that I can come up with the answer. Best regards, Alan.
Re: Serial Numbers John - 04:23 09/11/1998
Alan
Thanks for the reply, the gun that I am interested in is arround 15000, I have yet to see it, is there any item I should look for other than fair wear and tear ect.
Besr regards
John
Re: Serial Numbers Alan - 10:44 09/11/1998
John,
There is a gap in K-80 serial numbers from around 15,000 to 20,000, the gun you are interested in will therefore be a K-80 with the K-80 logo on the sides of the receiver. Sear springs will be the "bent wire" spring rather than the later coil spring, an upgrade to latest type is possible. The only other thing you look out for is that all the serial numbers match. Not really a problem if they don't (so long as the barrels and forearm fit perfectly) but it should reflect in the price.
Alan Re: K-80 price john kuechly - 19:02 24/08/1999
What would be the cost of a new K-80
Re: K-80 price Malcolm Kersey - 16:15 06/01/2000
What would be the cost of a new K-80
What is the price of a K-80 Top Single 34 inch trap barrell
Thanks David van Pelt Alan - 08:33 03/12/1998
David, thank you for your message left in the guest book. Your e.mail address was not complete and therefore I could not reply directly. sorry but I cannot help with your enquiry regarding Winchester 120 barrels. The gun was imported into the UK but there are not many spare barrels floating about. you could try some of the dealers but I would think you are more likely to find what you are looking for in the US.
alan
Sempert&Krieghoff.suhl Dave - 07:18 04/12/1998
I have a 16GA side by side serial#13055 that I would
like some info on.The gun was my grandfathers and is in very good shape.It has many diffent feachers, such
as a compartment in the stock for a sleeve and ammo to
make one side a rifle.It has a montycarlo stock,a rifle sight between the barrels and is engraved.I would like to get any info on the history and value of the gun.thank you very much for any help you can give.
Sempert&Krieghoff Alan - 08:50 04/12/1998
Dave, Sempert & Krieghoff was the pre-war trading name of what is now H. Krieghoff GmbH. After the war the factory in suhl was destroyed by the Russians along with all the paperwork and records. the Krieghoff family were evacuated to the West of Germany by the americans and started a new factory in Ulm. Due to the lack of serial number records for guns made before the war we cannot give you any specific information on yout gun. If you can provide more information such as barrel layout, side-by-side, side by side with rifle underneath, etc and the calibre of the rifle barrel we can try and give you more information. Is the gun a sidelock or boxlock? A photograph would especially help. Also your e.mail address would help so that we can forward any information to you.
Regards,
Alan.
Greetings Barry - 21:41 25/12/1998
Best wishes for a very MERRY CHRISTMAS and a HAPPY NEW YEAR. and thankyou for all of your interesting and informative answers to all of us.
Greetings Alan - 09:38 30/12/1998
Thanks for the note, my best wishes for the season to all our Krieghoff shooters, have a great 1999.
Alan.
Model 32 ejectors linda hawcroft - 11:43 29/12/1998
The ejectors on my Model 32 30" barrels are slightly worn and I am having the occasional problem where cartridges are getting stuck.
Where can I get new ejectors for a Model 32 30" barrels and what would be the cost.
I live South Manchester area of Cheshire.
Re: Model 32 ejectors Alan - 09:36 30/12/1998
Linda, sorry to hear you are having a problem with your Model 32. Unless the ejectors are actually broken it is unlikely to be them that are causing your problem. When you say "stuck" what exactly is happening? Are the cases going behind the ejector rim or just not clearing the chambers when you open the gun, or is the gun stiff to open? Give me a little more information and I will try to pinpoint the problem. New ejectors are available and in stock here so there will be no problem fixing the fault whatever it is. My suggestion would be to let me have a look at it in the workshop, no charge at all for estimates. I can either arrange to get the gun collected or perhaps meet you at a local shooting ground, North Wales SS at Sealand should be close to you. Whatever, we can solve the problem.
Best regards, .
Nigel Hirst Alan - 08:25 06/01/1999
Nigel,
I received your e.mail enquiry and have tried to reply twice but the mail is returned with the message "server unknown". Hopefully you will find this, if so please call me on 01978 780390. Alan
Trigger Creep in K-80 RT TOM - 06:39 28/01/1999
I own a k-80 RT combo and like it very much however it has a sleight creep in the (pull)trigger. I was told by the people at the Grand (twice)that this is common in the RT triggers and that they can not correct it. Do you know about this condition and is it true it can not be corrected. The creep is ever so slight as to be almost unnoticeable.I have owne this combo since Oct of 1992 and was wondering if later models corrected this condition. Although it is a known fact,since I have been shooting Skeet and Trap for 40 yrs, that you don't squeeze the trigger but you "slap" it in shotgunning. I have owned several guns with the creep problem ie: Browning,Beretta and even some Perazzi's that I have owned.
Re: Trigger Creep in K-80 RT Alan - 12:32 29/01/1999
Hi Tom,
Thanks for visiting the site. With regard to your trigger creep on an RT, I can tell you that it is not usual. I have an RT here now and the trigger has absolutely no movement at all before it "breaks". I would say that normally the RT is a little crisper than a standard K-80 but both can be set perfectly. You may not realise it but this web site is Krieghoff Service in the UK and so I am not in a position to look at your gun personally. My suggestion is to call Norbert Hausseman at Krieghoff International (610 847 5173) Norbert is head of the Service department there and I do not know of anyone who knows the K-80 better. I am certain that he will be able to solve the problem for you.
Best regards,
Alan
Re: Trigger Creep in K-80 RT TOM from USA - 05:02 30/01/1999
Hi Tom,
Thanks for visiting the site. With regard to your trigger creep on an RT, I can tell you that it is not usual. I have an RT here now and the trigger has absolutely no movement at all before it "breaks". I would say that normally the RT is a little crisper than a standard K-80 but both can be set perfectly. You may not realise it but this web site is Krieghoff Service in the UK and so I am not in a position to look at your gun personally. My suggestion is to call Norbert Hausseman at Krieghoff International (610 847 5173) Norbert is head of the Service department there and I do not know of anyone who knows the K-80 better. I am certain that he will be able to solve the problem for you.
Best regards,
Alan
Thanks a million for your advice I will certainly give Norbert a call because the people at the Grand have been giving me the wrong advice for the two years that I asked them about the problem.
I have had a little suspicion about the gunsmiths that I talked to there at the Grand Krieghoff booth.Alan I must tell you also that Iam no youngster,I'm 67 yrs old and I've probably owned more different brand of guns than those(youngster)Krieghoff people there at the Grand and that is why I had doubts about the answers they gave me. Again thanks a million Alan. I really appreciated your help. I just wish we could have you here in the USA. Incidentally I only live about 200 miles from OTTSVILLE Pa. and since I am retired I could drive there in about 3 1/2 hrs. so that's what I will probably do. Again thanks a million Alan for your help.
Re: Trigger Creep in K-80 RT Alan - 09:09 30/01/1999
Fred,
Norbert would normally be at the Grand but perhaps you did not get to speak to him. suggest that you give him a call and explain your problem before you take a long drive. I am sure he will be able to help you.
Alan
More on Loose Actions Fred Toelkes - 01:34 30/01/1999
Alan,
I posted this message on the end of the Loose Action thread from August and I think it got lost down there. I'll re-post it here as a new thread.
Here in the U.S. most Krieghoffs for trap are sold as "combos" with both a single and O/U barrel. My single barrel receives far more wear than the double. I am under the impression that the actions are re-tightened by installing oversized trunnions in the receiver. If the new trunnions are sized to re-tighten the single barrel, would they be too large for the O/U which has not seen nearly the wear?
This is a great site, I have found much useful information here.
Fred
Re: More on Loose Actions Alan - 08:55 30/01/1999
Fred,
I am really sorry that you did not get a reply to your earlier posting. you are right about it getting lost but it's my fault for not checking some of the older items. I must try harder. With regard to your query, the way the K-80 barrels are tightened onto the receiver depends on where the wear is if you will excuse the pun. If the barrels are "off the face" that is with a gap between the breech face of the barrels and the receiver then new hinge screws will be required. If the top lever has gone over to the centre it may be neccessary to fit an oversize top latch to bring the lever back over to the right. In both these cases it would alter the fit of the other barrels although that could be corrected. If the cause of the looseness is the forearm lug on the barrels it will be possible to improve things without altering your other barrels. There may be other things that could be done to the loose barrels but the best man to speak to is - Yes, you've got it - Norbert at Krieghoff International (610 847 5174) As I've said before Norbert probably knows more about the K-80 than anyone and he has great experience, both from the factory in Ulm and from his time in the USA. He will need both sets of barrels with the receiver but I am sure that he can improve things for you. Having said that you have to realise that if you use one pair of barrels in preference to the other, all the wear is taking place with that set of barrels and although it is possible to keep re-fitting the barrels it will ultimately involve putting some artifical "wear" on the other pair. Personally I do not worry about a little looseness and only do something about it when it gets to the severe stage. This is simply because I have the same problem you do and prefer not to alter my other barrels.
KS-5 late reply to Paul Alan - 09:07 30/01/1999
Paul,
Sorry about this late reply, I had missed your posting down at the bottom. If you pick up a thread low down in the list it is perhaps a good idea to either post your query as a new item at the top or send me an e.mail to alert me to the new question. I will aslo do my bit by checking down the list from time to time.
Regarding the KS-5, it is not a model we have here in the UK as our Trap uses both barrels scoring 3 for a first barrel kill and 2 for the second which means you loose a point every time you have to use your second barrel. Max score ex 100 targets is 300 points. I asked the factory about the KS-5 and they tell me it is still being produced and will continue. I had seen the ads in some of your magazines but these were not clearance guns but a promotion, this is what I am told straight from the factory. For sure like all manufacturers Krieghoff will have new products planned for the future but I do not believe a replacement for the KS-5 is due any time soon.
Alan.
Ejectors again Fred Toelkes - 02:01 03/02/1999
Thanks for the reply on the loose action question. I'm going to share this information with some of my K-80 shooting friends.
I am interested in another old thread regarding weak ejectors. I have experienced similar problems. Is it much of a job to change the springs? From a quick investigation, it looks like all that is necesary is to press out a small plug in each side of the forend iron.
Also, out of curiosty, how popular is bunker trap in the U.K.? Bunker fields are few and far between in the U.S. and bunker shooters are just as rare. Are K-80's popular with your bunker shooters "over there".
Thanks again,
Fred
Re: Ejectors Alan - 17:07 03/02/1999
Fred, the procedure for changing ejector springs is quite simple but you do need to take some care. Remove the forearm wood, on either side of the forearm iron you will see the little stud that stops the ejector hammer from flying completely out when the ejectors are tripped. With the ejectors cocked, drive out this stud from the inside of the iron to the outside. Point the knuckle of the iron down towards and close to a flat work surface. Place a wad of cloth on top of the work surface. Using a suitable tool, lift the sears out of engagement with the hammer notch, the ejector hammer will fly forward straight out of the iron onto the cloth. Repeat for the other side. Fit new springs with some grease and push the hammer assembly back into it's slide. Make sure that the guide rods line up with the holes. Push the assembly back until the sear engages in the hammer notch and holds the hammer back. Replace the stud and repeat the operation for the other side. Check that the hammers will push back far enough to allow the extractors to lie flush with the breech ends of the barrels, make sure that the springs are not "coil bound". Always use genuine Krieghoff supplied springs, do not be tempted to subsitute other springs in an attempt to make the ejectors stronger. The springs Krieghoff supply are the maximum length and diameter that will work in the gun, even these need to be checked to ensure that they are not coil bound. Points to note: Never point the knuckle of the forearm towards anyone once you have removed the retaining stud - these hammers come out with some force and you could blind or injure someone. Always keep the knuckle close to a work surface with an adequate layer of cloth to dampen the momentum. Never force anything, if you cannot follow how it comes out, don't attempt the job. Use genuine parts and check that they fit properly.
Bunker Trap, known as Olympic Trap in the UK has quite a strong following although recent rule changes mean that this is now declining. The change to 24gm loads coupled with faster targets means that the job is just too difficult for most shooters. The K-80 does not have a strong following for OT but this is mainly because, until recently, it has not been aggresively marketed in the UK. We now have some customers using the K-80 for OT and I expect that the numbers will grow.
Alan
Trigger variation Rick - 02:06 03/02/1999
I am a new K80 owner and generally very pleased however about 2% of the time it seems like the gun goes off before i am ready I for sure had a problem like this when I first bought the gun and it was corrcted at that time but now seems to have reappeared would appreciate recommendations on the best course of action and who can do the work thanks
Trigger variation? Alan - 17:11 03/02/1999
Rick,
I need some more information on this problem. When you say the gun goes off before you are ready for it, what exactly do you mean? I guess the gun is not firing by itself so at what point does it go off. Also, when you first had the gun and the problem was fixed, what did they tell you was causing it? Come back to me with some more detailed information and I will do my best to help.
Alan
Trigger variation Rick - 21:58 07/02/1999
thanks for your reply i guess the best way i could describe it would be from time to time (about every 100 rounds of so) it seems like the gun gets a "hair trigger" it does not go off by itself but seems to fire with much less trigger pull. Had the pull adjusted last week they found the first pull was to the light side (just under 3 lb) and reset it to 3.25 lb and the second pull was 3.75 lb which is supposed to be factory specs i have only fired about 75 rounds through it since the work but have not had the hair trigger since thanks for your help Rick
Re: Trigger variation Alan - 22:01 07/02/1999
Rick,
It sounds to me as if your K-80 is not fully cocking on the odd occasion, there could be a number of reasons for this. On a K-80 there should be some overthrow on the hammers when the gun is cocked. If you remove the stock and open the barrels slowly you should see both sears engage BEFORE the gun ejects, the gun should then open a little further. That is the first thing I would check. It could be that altering the pull weight has corrected things and I would agree that 3lbs is light. Personally I always set K-80s at 4lbs both, that way you can get a nice crisp pull without problems. The other thing that needs checking is the actual sear angle. If you lift the sear part of the way out of engagement with the hammer and then let it go it should drop back into the notch fully, if it doesn't that is your problem. Let me know how you get on.
Regards,
Alan
K-32 Edmund A Dworakowski - 14:27 03/02/1999
Did krieghoff produce the K-32 with a shiney nickel receiver?
Re: K-32 Alan - 17:15 03/02/1999
Yes. I have seen a number of Model 32s with nickelled receivers, mostly the very late ones, serial number around 11,500, these guns carried Mr Krieghoff's signature on the side of the receiver and were usually nickelled although I have seen some blued. Occassionally I see an older Model 32 with a nickel finish which may not have been original.
Alan
Barrels Donald Blue - 05:38 04/02/1999
Hello Alan, I had recently sent my K-80 to Krieghoff International to have a set of skeet barrels re-worked, they were loose and the top latch was in the center position, I also have a set of 30" trap barrels that were fine. I sent both barrels and after receiving them I was contacted by one of their gunsmiths, I was told that they could either re-work the monoblock on the 28" barrels along with welding the barrel ears or just weld the ears and use #3 hinge pins which would correct the headspace and would work with both barrels. The 28" barrels are fine, I have had no problem with them. I shoot competition skeet but sometimes I will shoot a round or two of trap and I have noticed that after about two rounds of trap with the 30" barrels the gun starts to get hard to open, it feels like something is binding. Is this something to worry about or should I just keep shooting them? When I first install the 30" barrels they feel ok, the gun opens and closes fine, it's only after firing about 50 rounds that they seem to get tight. What's your thoughts about this??
Thanks Alot,
Don Blue
Barrels Alan - 09:04 04/02/1999
Don,
I would not recommend that you continue to shoot the barrels without finding out what is causing the tightness. As you suspect, it sounds as if something is tightening up after a few rounds. This could be the forearm knuckle and, if ignored, could cause some metal scoring in this area. Another cause of difficult opening that I have encountered is when the headspace is just a little too tight, this can happen when barrels have been brought back onto the face by fitting the No 3 hinge pins. In this case however, the gun is just difficult to open with some cartridges all the time, not after 50 shots, deepening the headspace a couple of thou cures it. What do you use as a lubricant on the contact surfaces? My personal recommendation is a good quality load bearing grease, after shooting I clean this off completely and put new grease on immediately before assembling the gun the next time I shoot. A little tightness is normal on a gun that has just been jointed but if yours is only appearing after use it should be looked at. Call Norbert at Krieghoff International and ask him what he thinks is the causing the tightness. If you think it may be the headspace be sure to mention that to him. If he is happy that it is normal then I would take his word for that, he is very much in the business of giving the best service he can to Krieghoff shooters, if he thinks there is a problem he will say so. Let me know how this works out.
Alan
Re: Barrels Donald Blue - 01:25 05/02/1999
Alan, Thanks for the quick reply as usual. After checking the barrels again I inserted some fired casings in the barrel and tried to close the gun, it appears that the bottom shell is binding against the face of the receiver making it hard to open the gun, it is a headspace problem. I've only shot a few rounds with the barrel after getting it back and it appeared to only do it after firing a couple of rounds. I live in VA. and I'm driving up to New Jersey to Chris Maest's on the 10th to get a new stock, maybe I'll have him take a look at it while I'm there.
Thanks Alot,
Regards,
Don Blue
Don,
I would not recommend that you continue to shoot the barrels without finding out what is causing the tightness. As you suspect, it sounds as if something is tightening up after a few rounds. This could be the forearm knuckle and, if ignored, could cause some metal scoring in this area. Another cause of difficult opening that I have encountered is when the headspace is just a little too tight, this can happen when barrels have been brought back onto the face by fitting the No 3 hinge pins. In this case however, the gun is just difficult to open with some cartridges all the time, not after 50 shots, deepening the headspace a couple of thou cures it. What do you use as a lubricant on the contact surfaces? My personal recommendation is a good quality load bearing grease, after shooting I clean this off completely and put new grease on immediately before assembling the gun the next time I shoot. A little tightness is normal on a gun that has just been jointed but if yours is only appearing after use it should be looked at. Call Norbert at Krieghoff International and ask him what he thinks is the causing the tightness. If you think it may be the headspace be sure to mention that to him. If he is happy that it is normal then I would take his word for that, he is very much in the business of giving the best service he can to Krieghoff shooters, if he thinks there is a problem he will say so. Let me know how this works out.
Alan
Re: Barrels Alan - 17:09 05/02/1999
Don,
A fired case is not the best way of checking this although it may give you an idea. Having said that I suspect that your problem is headspace, I have found that if the headspace on the bottom barrel is at all tight it can make the gun a real job to open. It feels as if you have not pushed the top lever far enough across, then it starts to open but needs a real pull on the barrels to get it open. I use a Clymer "Go" headspace gauge and I like to feel it just slightly below flush. Remember that K-80 barrels are not flat across the breech face - the bottom barrel runs off. Now and again I will get a box of cartridges with slightly oversize rims and my own K-80 can be a real SOB to open, now I know I could cure it by deepening the rims slightly but it works fine so long as the cartridges are not oversize. Tight rim equals reduced recoil so I am not going to deepen mine just to accomodate oversize shell rims. What I am saying here is that you should not overdo the rim depth, the minimum that solves the problem is what you are looking for. I am sure that Chris Maest will be able to help.
Alan
K-32 serial# Edmund A. Dworakowski - 03:25 05/02/1999
I have made an offer on a K-32 that has been acepted.
I'm off this weekend to inspect and hopefully take it home.
Could you tell me when the gun was manufactured and how a gun of its vintage
compares with a K-80? Serial #6864
When making my inspection, what important things should I look for to insure that everything is as it should be?
By the way, this gun has K-80 wood and trigger. Also briely thin wall chokes. Overall condition is 99%
Can you offer an opinion on what its worth?
Thanks
Ed
K-32 Alan - 17:35 05/02/1999
Ed, you have given me a difficult one here. I cannot advise the value of a gun I have not seen, especially as prices here in the UK are not really comparable with yours. I will try to give you some answers. Firstly, a Model 32 #6000+ is quite a long way from a current K-80. Basically the gun shares a number of common features but the hold open device, the sear springs, hammers and ejectors are quite different. There have been other, more subtle changes made to the selector axle in the trigger mechanism and many other small but significant changes throughout the gun. Many parts are interchangeable with current K-80 manufacture and older design parts are still available from the factory. Some upgrading of the gun to later spec can be done but at a price. Nothing can be done with the hold open device and the frame will not accept the latest style K-80 hammers. What to look for depends on your own level of experience and expertise, for example if I told you to check that the axle is not broken, would you know where to find it and how to check? The main things are that all the numbers match and if they don't, does everything fit well. Again, are you able to tell if the barrels fit as they should? All you can do is look carefuly and thoroughly at the gun, be suspicious of anything that does not look or feel right. If you are not sure either get it checked by a professional or leave it where it is. I note that you say it has a K-80 trigger which if true will mean it is adjustable as the K-80 has always had an adjustable trigger. This will mean that it has had a complete new trigger unit as you cannot fit a K-80 trigger onto a Model 32 trigger unit (theoretically anyway) This could be good or bad, my first question would be "Who did the work?" K-80 woodwork and Briley chokes should add to the value but it depends on the wood. As you know, the K-80 has a tail on the trigger guard, the model 32 has not. Look at the back of the guard, has the stock been patched to fill the inletting for the guard or has a K-80 guard been fitted. Model 32 guards have two screws, the K-80 only one. Best bet would be to get the gun checked over by someone who really knows these guns. As to value, all I can say is that Model 32s of this age fetch - here in the UK - between £600 (US$960 and £950 (US $1520) If the gun is really mint and has nice woodwork and some upgrading to the mechanism it may fetch up to £1250 (US $2000) Later, Model 32s, mint condition with nickel receivers and the Signature logo on the side can fetch up to £3000 (US $4,800) I am not sure that these prices are at all relevant in the US and I suggest that you have a look what your dealers are selling them at. The Model 32 is still an excellent gun and one in good condition will give a lifetime of service, the biggest enemy is work that has been done on the gun by someone who does not really know what they are doing. Sorry I can't be of more help.
Alan
removal of ejectors Ron - 10:44 06/02/1999
In the general cleaning of my K80, should I remove
the ejectors and clean the area underneath? I had the gun serviced at last year's Grand American and plan to have it checked over again this year.
What is the best way to remove the ejectors. I have the later style ejectors (without the screw). I am happy to have found this discussion group. I have learned a great deal.
Re: removal of ejectors Alan - 21:36 06/02/1999
Ron,
Yes, you should remove your ejectors periodically and clean underneath. It is not necessary every time you clean the gun but certainly once a month, more often if you are shooting a lot. A build up of powder residue etc under the extractor puts strain on the jointing and can cause a broken extractor. Your late style ejectors are held in place by a ball with a soring underneath, note: it is NOT captive, this is because it would need to be removed to reblack the barrels. To remove the ejector give the back end of it a sharp tap - the plastic top of your stock wrench is ideal. The tap will "jump" the extractor over the ball, next push it slowly out of it's slide following behind with your thumb so that you will stop the ball and spring being lost. Remove the ball and pick the spring out of it's hole with a pin. Clean behind the extractor and in it's recess. Lubricate with a little grease before replacing. Place the spring back in the hole, sit the ball on top of it and just start the extractor in it's slide. Using the hex end of the stock wrench press the ball down onto the spring, slide the extractor over the top, displacing the wrench as you go. That is it, quick and simple. A word of warning, if you should loose the ball do not be tempted to replace it with another ball that may be the wrong size. If the ball is too small in diameter it will come up above it's diameter, if this happens it is impossible to remove the extractor. The only way to remove it would be to drill a tiny hole through the extractor above the ball and depress the ball through this hole with a pin. When you buy a new K-80 there is a little bag in with the instruction book that includes a spare ball and spring. If you have lost it contact Krieghoff International for another as it is a good spare to have. You can safely use the K-80 without the spring and ball in place as the extractor cannot come out with the gun assembled. The ball is only to prevent you loosing the extractor when the barrels are off the gun.
Alan
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